We had no idea eating salad could be so dangerous

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[00:00] SPEAKER_02: Welcome to Countless Podcast.
[00:05] SPEAKER_02: So Brad, Kristen, welcome to this introductory call.
[00:10] SPEAKER_02: I'll give you a little bit of context on how we arrived here.
[00:16] SPEAKER_02: I am an entrepreneur myself and give time pre-COVID that I had a co-working space.
[00:24] SPEAKER_02: And one of my colleagues really was working out of Vancouver and had a podcast back when podcasts weren't quite so prolific.
[00:35] SPEAKER_02: They were about 10 years ago.
[00:37] SPEAKER_02: And it was kind of new.
[00:38] SPEAKER_02: And he grew the Vancouver podcast to quite a large audience.
[00:42] SPEAKER_02: And then he had this vision of taking it national.
[00:45] SPEAKER_02: So, and then they reached out to, you know, some people that they knew in each province.
[00:51] SPEAKER_02: And we now are a team of nine podcasters, I think, that are really trying to share the story of what Canadian entrepreneurs are doing across the country with a much broader audience.
[01:03] SPEAKER_02: A, it's for you.
[01:06] SPEAKER_02: We've taken all the risk and the, you know, and so at this point, this is a organic kind of free podcast for you guys to share the story.
[01:16] SPEAKER_02: Obviously, our business model is that we engage sponsors, we engage advertisers like any other sort of traditional media.
[01:26] SPEAKER_02: But we also are really our foremost purpose is to share the stories of entrepreneurs that are doing pretty inspiring things across Canada.
[01:36] SPEAKER_02: So that's how we got here.
[01:39] SPEAKER_02: At the moment, most of the work that I do is in that volunteer capacity because it's fun.
[01:45] SPEAKER_02: And I get to meet amazing people.
[01:47] SPEAKER_02: My other hat is that I am a business consultant.
[01:50] SPEAKER_02: So I work in innovation and trying to help amazing project scale.
[01:55] SPEAKER_02: So I reached out to freight farms just to find out because I love what they're doing, right?
[02:01] SPEAKER_02: I love, I'm a farm girl from Southern Alberta who, you know, we have to leave the farm because it's not sustainable.
[02:10] SPEAKER_02: Introducing freight farms going, okay, there's, there's got to be a better way to use square footage of land to, you know, to produce food.
[02:19] SPEAKER_02: And that's why I was sort of attracted to freight farms thinking maybe this can actually, you know, this tool, this technology and this.
[02:27] SPEAKER_02: You know, the training and the support and everything that they do can actually help more local economies become more food sovereign, if you like, or produce more food locally.
[02:39] SPEAKER_02: And so I contacted them really from a, what do you guys need to expand and do more.
[02:47] SPEAKER_02: And they said, well, really, we need to share the stories of some bar local farmers.
[02:50] SPEAKER_02: And that are doing amazing things and that will help them, you know, create impact and they said, well, I've got this podcast with Canada's podcast.
[03:02] SPEAKER_02: Do you have an Canadian farmers that have a great story?
[03:05] SPEAKER_02: Boom, Greg and Kristen came to light and I said, oh my god, yes, let's, let's capture their story and.
[03:14] SPEAKER_02: And from a, you know, we are a podcast that talks about entrepreneurs with purpose, but also creating social environmental, you know, local impact.
[03:26] SPEAKER_02: When it comes from in a super emotional personal state, of course, it's going to have greater impact. So.
[03:36] SPEAKER_02: Really talking about the personal purpose, as well as the business of for acres, so that's we're sort of talking about two different things today.
[03:46] SPEAKER_02: So I want to just introduce you to this as a platform to share your story, hopefully grow your business and.
[03:57] SPEAKER_02: You know, maybe duplicate be able to scale what you're doing for other people who.
[04:04] SPEAKER_02: You know, have a similar purpose as you guys, so that's my background.
[04:10] SPEAKER_02: I'm going to totally turn the mic over and just say, where do you want to start? Let's talk about.
[04:19] SPEAKER_02: Maybe you're journey before starting for acres and why for acres as a as a business, how it came to be.
[04:31] SPEAKER_03: I don't know where you want to start.
[04:37] SPEAKER_03: I had never heard of freight farms or anything like that before.
[04:44] SPEAKER_03: Three years ago.
[04:49] SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it totally came to be because our son got sick with equal life.
[04:57] SPEAKER_03: And he died.
[04:59] SPEAKER_03: So.
[05:00] SPEAKER_03: So we started looking into other options.
[05:07] SPEAKER_03: Yeah, where do you ready what we just start?
[05:10] SPEAKER_04: That was three years ago.
[05:12] SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, three and a half years ago.
[05:16] Speaker UNKNOWN: Okay.
[05:16] SPEAKER_03: That was a tipping point for us in a lot of ways in our life.
[05:22] SPEAKER_02: And we're doing before that.
[05:24] SPEAKER_02: Brad, Chris.
[05:27] SPEAKER_03: We've had a farm for about 10 years now.
[05:30] SPEAKER_03: Okay.
[05:31] SPEAKER_03: Just did vegetable gardening, kind of small scale sold at the vegetables at the farmers markets.
[05:37] SPEAKER_03: And just kind of growing our own food and for a few family and friends.
[05:40] SPEAKER_03: Not really big scale, but.
[05:44] SPEAKER_03: Yeah, construction work, just.
[05:48] SPEAKER_03: Normal life.
[05:50] Speaker UNKNOWN: 
[05:53] SPEAKER_04: And in your small scale farm.
[05:59] SPEAKER_04: Prior to three years ago.
[06:02] SPEAKER_04: What.
[06:05] SPEAKER_04: What.
[06:06] SPEAKER_04: What.
[06:06] SPEAKER_02: Did you what technology is or what.
[06:11] SPEAKER_02: What considerations do you use in your.
[06:15] SPEAKER_02: You know, growing that.
[06:18] SPEAKER_02: Has sort of shifted to three years ago to leveraging things like, you know, the freight farms infrastructure and being perhaps mindful.
[06:26] SPEAKER_02: What are the what are the pivots that you made.
[06:30] SPEAKER_02: In going from a small scale farm.
[06:33] Speaker UNKNOWN: And then you're.
[06:34] SPEAKER_02: Prior to three years ago to today.
[06:36] SPEAKER_02: What are the major pivots feel.
[06:39] SPEAKER_03: We've always been.
[06:41] SPEAKER_03: Supportive of like the organic idea.
[06:43] SPEAKER_03: So we never sprayed anything on our, on our gardens.
[06:49] SPEAKER_03: Bugs and pull weights by hand.
[06:53] SPEAKER_03: But just outdoor really simple gardening.
[06:56] Speaker UNKNOWN: So I think.
[06:57] SPEAKER_03: I think.
[06:57] SPEAKER_03: Great farms obviously is high tech.
[07:01] SPEAKER_03: End or.
[07:05] SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
[07:05] SPEAKER_03: High different technologies.
[07:06] SPEAKER_03: So it's.
[07:07] SPEAKER_03: So it's year round.
[07:08] SPEAKER_03: The whole point was year round.
[07:09] SPEAKER_03: Because we can't grow that stuff here.
[07:12] SPEAKER_03: One of the main points I guess is, that we can grow it in the wintertime.
[07:17] SPEAKER_04: Right.
[07:17] SPEAKER_02: locally. And how did you find freight farms and why was it so important?
[07:27] SPEAKER_03: We just just searched it online just to see what was out there. I mean we figured
[07:31] SPEAKER_03: hydroponics indoors is probably the only way that we can grow here in the winter time.
[07:39] SPEAKER_03: So we just left out a few different companies and that's the one that we ended up choosing to
[07:44] SPEAKER_02: work with. Is there any particular reason why them versus the competition?
[07:51] SPEAKER_03: I just seem like they were the most I guess advanced but out of the few that we left out.
[07:58] SPEAKER_03: Yeah really good support team to talk to and help us learn because we had no idea what we're doing
[08:03] SPEAKER_03: and we started it, never done anything like that for us. So really helpful getting us started.
[08:08] SPEAKER_02: That was important. And here you are.
[08:12] SPEAKER_02: You know a traditional agricultural boutique farmer now investing in this advanced technology
[08:22] SPEAKER_02: to produce your round. I mean what was your capital investment?
[08:28] SPEAKER_03: I put 150,000 to buy the shipping container with everything in it.
[08:34] SPEAKER_03: It's set up ready to go.
[08:37] SPEAKER_02: So with capital investment like that obviously you have a business plan right and it has to be
[08:42] SPEAKER_02: a business in order to be able to find out. I'm assuming you've financed it.
[08:48] SPEAKER_02: Maybe that assumption. Did you purchase that right?
[08:51] SPEAKER_03: We didn't have much of a business plan. We just went in, you know it was it was
[08:58] SPEAKER_03: less than a year after our son died and thinking about money and business wasn't. I'm only now
[09:04] SPEAKER_03: able to really focus on that and figure it out. So it was more just dive in and have faith that it's
[09:13] SPEAKER_01: going to work out. So yeah we just I want to take it back to what we did before. So we had
[09:21] SPEAKER_01: we used to build homes and renovate homes in Selda. So we had a commercial and residential
[09:28] SPEAKER_01: property that we had just sold a year prior to our son passing away.
[09:33] SPEAKER_01: So that was like our nest egg and we used a lot of that. Well all of it plus remorges
[09:39] SPEAKER_01: our house to buy the farm. So we had some savings aside to help us get started.
[09:48] SPEAKER_02: And you were you were all in at this point. Yeah it's probably better if you go about it with
[09:54] SPEAKER_03: business loans and I'm just starting to learn about that now so you don't have to
[09:58] SPEAKER_03: you know put all of our personal money into it. Absolutely.
[10:01] SPEAKER_03: I'm voting so.
[10:05] SPEAKER_02: Absolutely. And let's talk about a little bit about day to day. What does your day to day look like
[10:13] SPEAKER_01: with this? We have a few farmers. Here at home we have three kids a year and a half,
[10:20] SPEAKER_01: three and a half and seven. So our day can be pretty hacked it.
[10:28] SPEAKER_01: Yeah coordinating with the kids and it's nice that we work from home because a lot of times I
[10:33] SPEAKER_01: can break from the farm and come back in and help Brad or do what we need to do.
[10:40] SPEAKER_01: Yeah we employ to we have two employees that help us out at the farms well and they're both
[10:45] SPEAKER_01: local. They're very close.
[10:53] SPEAKER_02: And then I had a quick look at your website as far as your products where you've got
[11:00] SPEAKER_02: kale, you got mixed greens, things like that. And who buys your product?
[11:09] SPEAKER_03: We've been selling farm gate just to friends and neighbors started it that way.
[11:14] SPEAKER_03: Just recently we're getting into stores now so we're in grocery store and
[11:18] SPEAKER_03: gamble for it in your bytown and two more that we've just gotten into in the last month or so.
[11:26] SPEAKER_03: So just just starting that part of it it's going well they're selling it pretty well and
[11:33] SPEAKER_03: kind of demanding more so. So it's just kind of yeah crossing that
[11:39] SPEAKER_02: fresh. So local retail stores yeah armgator you're too main sort of.
[11:45] SPEAKER_01: We do we started out with like a koa that's buy weekly so it essentially she connects all
[11:54] SPEAKER_01: local farmers so we supply her with our produce and people shop on her website for it.
[12:02] SPEAKER_04: It's working.
[12:03] SPEAKER_04: Okay.
[12:07] SPEAKER_02: And she distributes like I'm going to make the assumption it would be something like a
[12:12] SPEAKER_02: veggie box or something like that where there's multiple growers in you know one product and
[12:19] SPEAKER_02: purchasers that can buy multiple products. Cool. Awesome.
[12:25] SPEAKER_02: And is are you at a state and this is a personal question so are you at a state now in the business
[12:33] SPEAKER_02: where you can self-support almost almost okay almost sustainable or viable but
[12:42] SPEAKER_03: yeah with just one freight farm yeah what do you mean by self-support I guess that's the question.
[12:49] SPEAKER_03: What's that Brad sorry? What does self-support mean?
[12:52] SPEAKER_02: Self-support I guess means in my sort of definition is are you able to state and sustain a family?
[13:00] SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
[13:01] SPEAKER_02: It's your local business of your freight farm.
[13:06] SPEAKER_03: No.
[13:07] SPEAKER_03: Okay. No, no, we're just we're just looking to break even on it right now.
[13:12] SPEAKER_01: Okay.
[13:14] SPEAKER_03: It's and it's just it's just been such a learning curve for us like absolutely.
[13:19] SPEAKER_03: It can work and the numbers can work but we still have work to do to get there.
[13:23] SPEAKER_02: And what is that work? What do you know you need to do next if you well and I guess but let me
[13:28] SPEAKER_02: back to talk with break even is your goal now you're pretty close to that.
[13:34] SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
[13:35] SPEAKER_02: Perfect.
[13:36] SPEAKER_02: What's the sort of forecast and I'm only just going to project near and like maybe two years
[13:41] SPEAKER_02: is is it a goal to get this to the point where this is your primary source of income for your
[13:47] SPEAKER_02: family?
[13:47] SPEAKER_02: Um.
[13:54] SPEAKER_03: Not really like it's it's really about just doing the right thing and and creating the local
[14:01] SPEAKER_03: food and giving people the choice like I really don't care too much about the money
[14:07] SPEAKER_03: have to because if I don't then we don't have a business.
[14:12] SPEAKER_03: Not staying the boat right?
[14:13] SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
[14:13] SPEAKER_03: So that's that's all it is for me.
[14:17] SPEAKER_03: So yeah if we can if we can make a business and and turn a profit then then then we can expand.
[14:24] SPEAKER_03: And uh.
[14:25] SPEAKER_02: Well then and let me let let me share my kind of two cents on that um idea about
[14:34] SPEAKER_02: I know there's a bit of a steer away from profit and business etc but at the end of the day
[14:40] SPEAKER_02: we want you to be profitable in the business because a we need the food and if you're not producing it
[14:47] SPEAKER_02: then the food's not available which is really the number one priority is to make you know
[14:54] SPEAKER_02: safe organic good food available to families and two is you know we'd like you to continue to keep
[15:02] SPEAKER_02: we being the proverbial we would like you to keep going with this because if you can
[15:07] SPEAKER_02: if you can make it purpose driven and I realize the money is not it but you still your family has to
[15:15] SPEAKER_02: eat right they still need to um you know go to school and pay rents and all of that
[15:22] SPEAKER_02: love is in our systems that that we need to so we want you to be viable even if viable really
[15:29] SPEAKER_02: is and resilience is really more than maybe position that would love to see for you versus
[15:36] SPEAKER_02: you know the it's it's not so much the money profit mentality it's the can we do this again and again
[15:45] SPEAKER_02: right like can we do this for the bills can we do this in in other places and it's really getting
[15:52] SPEAKER_02: that insight on what it takes so you're three years in to a startup phase where you're break even
[15:57] SPEAKER_02: I actually think that's pretty amazing because of the learning curve yeah that it takes right as far
[16:04] SPEAKER_02: as what works who's going to buy who's interested who cares about the quality of the product um it
[16:12] SPEAKER_02: practicing with your products and your yield I would assume has been quite a good journey
[16:16] SPEAKER_02: big yeah that's a big part yeah do you want to talk a little bit about that how you
[16:21] SPEAKER_02: ended on the products that you've got and and you know you've got two employees already right so
[16:27] SPEAKER_02: and what are they helping are they helping with yield and what are they doing on the ground
[16:32] SPEAKER_01: so they mainly help with the harvest which consume the majority of the time in the farm is okay
[16:40] SPEAKER_01: and they help with some cleaning because that's also you need to keep the farm clean but the majority
[16:46] SPEAKER_02: of our time is spent harvesting product and then how do you get it I mean obviously farm gait is
[16:55] SPEAKER_02: there at your place so that's reasonably easy how do you get it to stores so we deliver it
[17:01] SPEAKER_01: yeah okay that's once a week or buy weekly we make a delivery and the
[17:08] SPEAKER_01: already of our stops are no further than an hour from us so we also do like pick up points so
[17:17] SPEAKER_01: the furthest city would be Pita Burrell an hour away so we would deliver there but we also
[17:22] SPEAKER_01: have a pickup point at Brad's parents house and then there's customers that buy in Pita Burrell
[17:28] SPEAKER_01: that would come to their house and also pick up so which is farm essentially like farm gait right yes
[17:37] SPEAKER_02: and I mean even that farm gait what what has been your biggest barriers to
[17:47] SPEAKER_02: I guess getting the you know the small business of organic vegetable growing to more people
[18:01] SPEAKER_03: just learning how to do it just just getting it all set off once it's once it's running people love it
[18:07] SPEAKER_03: it's there's really no competition that the quality is amazing compared to the typical stuff that
[18:16] SPEAKER_01: you get at the store yeah the shelf life not to mention all the other shelf life is incredible as well
[18:22] SPEAKER_01: so people are very we've never had a bad comment we always have very positive feedback from
[18:29] SPEAKER_01: our products and everyone's blown away by how long it keeps because the majority of the stuff you
[18:34] SPEAKER_01: are you buy when you purchase it you're already picking through it because it's been in a truck
[18:39] SPEAKER_01: right it's probably two weeks old by the time it's hitting your shelf yes so ours would be 24
[18:44] SPEAKER_01: 48 hours max by the time it's hitting the shelf in your vine
[18:49] SPEAKER_01: so yeah that I would agree with Brad that the majority is learning how to grow the products and
[18:56] SPEAKER_01: how to troubleshoot if you're seeing something in the farm how to solve that with your crops
[19:03] SPEAKER_01: we've done some experimenting also what people like so really don't even on what is our top sellers
[19:11] SPEAKER_01: and working with that which is our spring necklace now when you say experimenting Kristen
[19:20] SPEAKER_01: how did you experiment just try lots of varieties of plants okay yeah just lots of different varieties
[19:30] SPEAKER_01: and then as you might try multiple different kinds before you find one that you're happy with
[19:36] SPEAKER_01: that works and that produces what you what you want as an end result so you've got kind of the
[19:44] SPEAKER_02: the experimenting for two things what sort of the desirability from your customers and then
[19:51] SPEAKER_02: viability from a can we grow it can we produce enough is it good you know is it a good
[20:01] SPEAKER_02: production variety so I'm going to imagine that those two experiments really have to merge
[20:07] SPEAKER_02: and converge yes yes and you found the spring mixes are the most popular yes I also found
[20:20] SPEAKER_01: through experimenting that I can leave them growing in my farm longer so I've reduced my labor on
[20:28] SPEAKER_01: seeding and transplanting so I'm able to use those plants longer because I can pick every leaf
[20:34] SPEAKER_02: and make wow yeah a lot of love yeah that's it well that's so just going back to that that's the
[20:43] SPEAKER_02: logistics I'm imagining in as I look at some of the images of the freight farm so you don't actually just
[20:51] SPEAKER_02: take the whole lettuce for instance with a spring mixture out of the pod we're actually harvesting
[20:57] SPEAKER_02: the leaves and keeping that for regrowth yes so originally in the beginning I was harvesting
[21:04] SPEAKER_01: whole head and then I realized through trial and error that this is not viable that if I can
[21:11] SPEAKER_01: leave this in and pick the leaves and it will keep growing for multiple harvest interesting all
[21:17] SPEAKER_01: that time in okay works for the farm that's yeah yeah so it makes it a more viable crop for us
[21:26] SPEAKER_02: so in that then you're begging the leaves then and shipping yeah so we have big totes and we use
[21:32] SPEAKER_01: multiple different leaves in our spring mix so it's really a work of art and we bag it and tag it
[21:39] SPEAKER_02: and it goes out we do it yeah just I'm only sharing because my mom was a spin farmer so the
[21:45] SPEAKER_02: which was a small plot intensive farmer and she had about four spin farms around an urban
[21:54] SPEAKER_02: containment area and she she ran this farm with the with the household deliveries and the
[22:02] SPEAKER_02: begging and going to market ready it's she did this so she had a delivery service and then she went
[22:06] SPEAKER_02: to markets I've never seen anybody work so hard in my whole entire life actually that's
[22:11] SPEAKER_02: first up hours begging you know and she had quite a variety of of seed but honestly I swear to
[22:17] SPEAKER_02: God it was like a you know retirement passion project for her and I just she was working
[22:23] SPEAKER_02: easily 12 hours a day on this farm because it's so seasonal and so I feel
[22:32] SPEAKER_02: I can imagine what is going on in your house right now that hopefully you've got your seven-year-old
[22:38] SPEAKER_02: child labor involved in the farm I give her as much as we can yeah yeah well and I would like to go
[22:47] SPEAKER_02: back a little bit to the personal sensitive topic about safety with food I can't imagine
[23:02] SPEAKER_02: losing a child so that's I'm just saying I feel it I've got a 12-year-old and a 15-year-old myself
[23:10] SPEAKER_02: I would love and what's his name our son was named Cooper Cooper so it's difficult to talk about
[23:25] SPEAKER_02: the loss and I don't want your loss to be undermined at all I can you know three years after
[23:32] SPEAKER_02: Cooper's left us and here we are telling the story and I can be a little credit for be able to
[23:39] SPEAKER_02: share this story E. coli and other sort of food-borne viruses and diseases are not something to be
[23:49] SPEAKER_02: taken lightly what has been your experience in finding out about E. coli in particular or anything
[23:59] SPEAKER_02: else and you know why is this such an important topic to be raised for families
[24:12] SPEAKER_01: I think before we were affected with this I never thought about it at all and never crossed my mind
[24:21] SPEAKER_01: if I saw something on television I would read it and think nothing else of it after
[24:26] SPEAKER_01: because I feel that there's not enough emphasis put on the fact of how dangerous
[24:32] SPEAKER_01: we've worn illness is it is not just a stomach bug especially in kids under five it affects them more
[24:43] SPEAKER_01: and we also don't talk about the fact that it's on the rise and why is it in our food and where is
[24:49] SPEAKER_01: it coming from no one talks about that we need to start talking about that how our food is being
[24:54] SPEAKER_01: produced and why it is even there and I think the more it happens we're almost being desensitized to
[25:02] SPEAKER_01: it that it's enormous right well okay the odd timer or let us or salad bags are being recalled okay
[25:09] SPEAKER_01: just another recall but it should not be like that and now leafy greens have more recalls and
[25:16] SPEAKER_01: have a higher chance of having a coolant and then ground beef so we need to start asking why
[25:22] SPEAKER_01: is that happening and and changing something to food it and have you discovered any of those
[25:31] SPEAKER_01: wise yourself the food production for feed lots so in close proximity to these farms of where they're
[25:41] SPEAKER_01: growing and irrigating the crops seems to be the number one cause about it's leaching into our food
[25:52] SPEAKER_03: there's a hundred thousand cows in the feed lot and then across the street they're growing leafy
[25:59] SPEAKER_04: greens right that's how it is it's happening all the time so the one that in 2018
[26:12] SPEAKER_03: October you probably heard about it on the news it was international news Canada U.S. recall of all
[26:20] SPEAKER_03: remain so that was a really really big recall but there's smaller recalls that you would never hear
[26:26] SPEAKER_02: about happening all the time well and one question I have is how do you hear about these recalls
[26:35] SPEAKER_02: and do we rely on our distribution centers like our stores to yeah there's
[26:43] SPEAKER_03: stop food born illness website they have a they have a I think that you sign up to and then it'll
[26:53] SPEAKER_03: send you emails when there's a recall that's in your area so we've signed up to that and then you
[26:58] SPEAKER_03: can see all these other ones but if I didn't but I was not on that I would never hear about them
[27:02] SPEAKER_03: they're not on the news they're not on they're not you only hear about a few of them there's a
[27:09] SPEAKER_03: mushroom recall this week you'd hear about that one pretty big one it's in I think it's all across
[27:15] SPEAKER_03: Canada Sam and all I think in mushrooms yeah it's it's it's everywhere it's a lot more than I'd
[27:26] SPEAKER_03: ever thought and it's and it's really underreported to ones that we're learning about it's it's way worse
[27:33] SPEAKER_04: than when can you read about find it about Kristen you were going to add something
[27:40] SPEAKER_01: well I just um you're saying how we find out about it I don't we do rely on our grocery stores to
[27:48] SPEAKER_01: protect us right if the food is unsafe we rely on them to take the food off but if it's just an
[27:54] SPEAKER_01: advisory that's up to the grocery store they do not have to take that off the shelf so sometimes
[28:00] SPEAKER_01: there will be an advisory so it's up to you that they advise you not to eat that particular food
[28:07] SPEAKER_01: because they're maybe contaminated but unless it is recalled then restaurants and
[28:14] SPEAKER_01: grocery stores you not have to take that off the shelf and can sell it to you and I'm going to go
[28:20] SPEAKER_02: back to your comment about this statistics um you know we see something in the news or we hear a
[28:29] SPEAKER_02: story about a recall in another comment so we're in another area and I I agree with you I think we
[28:37] SPEAKER_02: tend to dismiss and or say oh well either it's not that serious or somebody will look after us
[28:46] SPEAKER_02: yeah right I I think there's this the grocery stores will look after us they'll take it off their
[28:52] SPEAKER_02: shelves if they it's the team it important uh the doctors will look after us if we get sick
[28:59] SPEAKER_02: the food inspection agencies the food inspection agency the government agencies that are maybe
[29:07] SPEAKER_02: testing to see yeah talking foods I mean there's an awful lot of of uh I'll call it um
[29:18] SPEAKER_02: out sourcing yeah of personal safety for food which is the fuel that keeps us healthy and and keeps
[29:27] SPEAKER_02: us entertained let's us live every day and so you know I'm taking a little bit of caution as well
[29:36] SPEAKER_02: just from from your story which is how much personal responsibility should we we're trying to get
[29:43] SPEAKER_02: back on you know food which is our food and water being our you know maybe housing those three
[29:49] SPEAKER_02: things are really the pillars to our health and well-being what what are your thoughts on that 100%
[29:57] SPEAKER_03: how can you outsource anything like that it's not working that's that's how the system set up but it
[30:04] SPEAKER_03: doesn't work they're doing the best they can with what they have I think I've talked to some people in
[30:11] SPEAKER_03: the Canadian food inspection agency about specifically about the repuls with lettuce and how they're
[30:17] SPEAKER_03: handling it and the people that I talk to are doing the best they can I feel with that with what they
[30:24] SPEAKER_03: have but it's just the way they're growing it is just so horrible it's just impossible to fix
[30:34] SPEAKER_02: and it's gonna happenings right do we leave it as impossible to fix or do we um
[30:41] SPEAKER_02: start changing things at a personal level and this is why I think your story is just so so important to
[30:47] SPEAKER_03: share that it is doable yes not the only way I'm trying to you know work with the government or
[30:57] SPEAKER_03: fight them or you know the industry whatever but it's it's hopeless the only way is if we do it
[31:03] SPEAKER_03: that's the only way completely replace that with something it does and so if you could
[31:09] SPEAKER_02: so two things for you and your story and your longevity of this business is if you can wave a
[31:21] SPEAKER_02: magic wand and say these three things would help us get to viable sustainable um enough for
[31:31] SPEAKER_02: for both your family but also for your community be able to supply food to your community what are the
[31:37] SPEAKER_02: one not two or three things that you would love to go boom here's what I'd love to happen
[31:45] SPEAKER_01: I would like to see government funding more of this and helping farmers out
[31:51] SPEAKER_01: they help out with other things but why not hydroponic farming something that um
[31:56] SPEAKER_01: gives more it's it's it's more local right so with more of work and trying our food source we're not
[32:02] SPEAKER_01: relying on these other countries to do it for us without any would I see much regulation they say
[32:09] SPEAKER_01: there's regulations but I don't you know this is what we could do to sustain farmers here in Canada
[32:16] SPEAKER_01: so it would because it's so expensive to get started I feel that that's why we don't maybe see
[32:22] SPEAKER_01: as many farmers getting into it here and in Canada there is more I think overhead costs um you know
[32:30] SPEAKER_01: in the winter for electricity and stuff um that maybe and if it was growing maybe in the United States
[32:36] SPEAKER_01: they wouldn't have those same overhead costs but it is doable they have them in Alaska
[32:44] SPEAKER_04: uh second on your wish list
[32:51] SPEAKER_03: I don't really care about the government too much so I wouldn't ask for them to get involved
[32:56] SPEAKER_03: and do it they're they're run by other things the companies that the multi-billion dollar
[33:04] SPEAKER_03: companies that are producing our food today and uh I feel like they have a lot of control in the
[33:10] SPEAKER_03: food inspection and the safety and regulations and how it gets reported what we know about it
[33:17] SPEAKER_03: unless you really dig into it so I think it has to be more organic just uh
[33:23] SPEAKER_03: real people entrepreneurs doing it and uh yeah maybe talking to you and helping us make a
[33:32] SPEAKER_03: viable business and then if it's viable other people can do it absolutely um
[33:38] SPEAKER_02: so talking to business coaches getting this viable faster might be a second wish list so
[33:44] SPEAKER_02: that more people are doing yeah yeah awesome yeah number three on the wish list
[33:56] SPEAKER_03: yeah tiny to think about this good question I don't have a magic wand so
[34:01] SPEAKER_03: okay um
[34:09] SPEAKER_04: oh very one
[34:16] SPEAKER_03: we come back to it of course we can wish list if I had a magic wand Terry magic wand fairy
[34:23] SPEAKER_03: because it's amazing what can happen yeah oh um should I ask myself in your answer no you
[34:29] SPEAKER_02: got to put it out there you got to say it yeah okay no that's good okay so we'll come back to
[34:34] SPEAKER_02: wish list number three okay let's talk a little bit about the um
[34:46] SPEAKER_02: the let's assume that the solution is to uh I'll use language like there's core business
[34:53] SPEAKER_02: and then there's edge business and I see what you're doing as an edge business um it's it's
[35:00] SPEAKER_02: innovative it's boutique it's hyper local uh it's all about you know the healthiest most
[35:06] SPEAKER_02: sustainable uh food options and if you were to if you could scale your operation it might mean you
[35:15] SPEAKER_02: could feed more people from a local perspective and I think Kristen you said instead of relying on
[35:21] SPEAKER_02: imports and mass production farmers we can actually you know start a movement of
[35:31] SPEAKER_02: viable organic farmers that um you know that this is one solution let's start with leafy greens
[35:38] SPEAKER_02: because it's a very vulnerable product for you know disease and and you know whether it's
[35:47] SPEAKER_02: or sam and elah that in the end it's one of the most healthy foods for us so if we start with your
[35:54] SPEAKER_02: product mix and say let's grow this movement of boutique organic farmers how can we do it at scale
[36:01] SPEAKER_02: I mean taking your learning it's not easier at the three month mark you've really done a lot of
[36:08] SPEAKER_02: experimentation can we take what you've learned and share it to say listen this is what you need to
[36:15] SPEAKER_02: start with you're in Canada here's what the here's what the consumers are asking for I mean
[36:22] SPEAKER_02: it's that of uh something that you can share uh yeah that's exactly yeah we can save people two
[36:30] SPEAKER_03: years worth of experimenting we're we're not fabulous we're close to that point where we can
[36:36] SPEAKER_03: write it down and send you here's what to grow how to grow it and uh within five weeks of getting
[36:42] SPEAKER_03: a container ship to your property you can be harvesting that and it's amazing yeah that would be
[36:53] SPEAKER_02: an amazing thing I know you say that loosely but there to me that is yeah list number three for me
[36:58] SPEAKER_02: is that guide right that how to fast your your freight farm experience to yeah so to learn from
[37:09] SPEAKER_02: the other farmers I'm sure you're not the only ones right like there's other freight farmers that
[37:13] SPEAKER_02: could collaborate on a on a booklet or publication like that yeah meaning that it takes away some of
[37:20] SPEAKER_02: the risk and we might actually get some funders that could that are willing to invest in those
[37:28] SPEAKER_02: you know and I mean freight farms is how we came together but you have other suppliers you've got
[37:33] SPEAKER_02: seed suppliers you've got your pond suppliers I mean you've obviously given your your passion
[37:41] SPEAKER_02: and your story as you thought a lot and researched a lot even about finding the best suppliers can
[37:48] SPEAKER_02: you talk a little bit about your seed and pot suppliers or anybody else that's in your essential
[37:53] SPEAKER_03: partner mix seeds we get from vests and jones to seed companies yeah I don't think
[38:04] SPEAKER_03: the research is too much we'd bought off them before to just for our gardening and
[38:10] SPEAKER_01: beet plugs or do you think it's a zip row here I think they're located at a cornwall so they
[38:17] SPEAKER_01: they were one of the first companies actually that we looked into because they sell vertical towers
[38:23] SPEAKER_01: but they would you would have to create your own building to put them in so the cost was higher
[38:28] SPEAKER_01: where freight farms come save it again Christopher what what was that zip row so they're the first
[38:36] SPEAKER_01: company that we looked into and they create they sell you the towers to grow it but you would have
[38:42] SPEAKER_01: to provide the building so when you get the cost it was twice as much as what freight farms offered us
[38:51] SPEAKER_01: with the free fab build right so but they sell the beet plugs so that's who we we get our beet plugs
[38:58] SPEAKER_02: through them okay interesting and I mean even just that knowledge right is here's some here's
[39:05] SPEAKER_02: some suppliers but we went with freight farms and here's some seed vendors and this is why we went
[39:10] SPEAKER_02: with those guys and here's their let's get through as an experimentation down into three months
[39:17] SPEAKER_02: and get your your organic farm launched faster the guidebook the webinar the trading seminar the
[39:25] SPEAKER_02: the half-day event would I think be pretty amazing to put on and and that would be really neat I
[39:37] SPEAKER_02: would love to see that happening and maybe you're you're the impetus and and kickstarter to something
[39:44] SPEAKER_02: like that I'm gonna that so those are some of my wish list items I'm gonna go back have you
[39:49] SPEAKER_03: thought yet of a third wish list um yeah like a new economic model for for food um the way
[40:01] SPEAKER_03: that works now it's profit comes first and at all cost that's it let's make money let's get really big
[40:10] SPEAKER_03: control at all it doesn't work that's that's inequality and it's destructive it's killing people
[40:19] SPEAKER_03: so I think everybody should be involved in it if we if we have sustainable food um
[40:28] SPEAKER_03: instead of it for us if instead of us personally getting rich by selling food if we were to
[40:33] SPEAKER_03: expand this take that and reinvest it back into more sustainable food and only that we just need
[40:42] SPEAKER_03: enough to live and that's it I don't want any more than that yes and if you keep rolling it into it
[40:47] SPEAKER_03: and could you have a snowball with the money in fact a bit too expanding that makes sense
[40:54] SPEAKER_02: it makes perfect sense and I love the fact that you went about as big picture as it can get
[40:59] SPEAKER_02: that yeah and you know my model for food okay well we can we can work on that I love it
[41:06] SPEAKER_02: yeah yeah and you know and but it does Brad it does start one sugar container booting at a time
[41:14] SPEAKER_02: right it really does yeah and this is part of why I wanted to share your story uh is because I
[41:22] SPEAKER_02: believe that one small step towards the right thing to do uh and I'd love to try and rally some
[41:29] SPEAKER_02: additional supporters and you know there's lots of people who have a similar mindset to you which is
[41:35] SPEAKER_02: it's really both the health and well-being of of people first and food is the primary tool to do
[41:42] SPEAKER_02: that let's make sure it's not poisoning our people right make sure that it's not um it's not a
[41:51] SPEAKER_02: capitalist project alone we need to shift uh and I love your wording shift the economic model for food
[41:59] SPEAKER_02: yeah and if this story can help stimulate that's great what would you love to see as an action
[42:05] SPEAKER_02: follow-up post podcast but what do you think is the very next step that we could take to maybe get
[42:13] SPEAKER_03: some of those magic wandwishless into action oh yeah good question so um wait and see what happens
[42:24] SPEAKER_03: let's just let it be organic who's interested in what we're doing and how can you help
[42:32] SPEAKER_03: how can we help you with what you're doing work together where's the rest of the super heroes
[42:40] SPEAKER_02: we're gonna change the world so I would like your permission I love that
[42:47] SPEAKER_02: find the super heroes that are going to change the food there are many that have interviewed
[42:54] SPEAKER_02: both on Canada's podcast but also what's called the next Gen Economy Podcast and both one
[43:02] SPEAKER_02: Canada's podcast is really quite a Canadian audience of course we have because it's digital we have
[43:10] SPEAKER_02: global audience as well but the next Gen Economy Podcast is really exactly like you said it's
[43:16] SPEAKER_02: about the next generation of thinkers and change agents who are doing the right thing and we're
[43:23] SPEAKER_02: sharing their story and this podcast and there's a global art community member is 17,000 change
[43:28] SPEAKER_02: agents coaches consultants around the world that are trying to reinvent new business models so I would
[43:34] SPEAKER_02: really like permission to share your story with both of those audiences yeah okay yay let me ask what
[43:44] SPEAKER_02: if we're if we're going with your organic flow there's a couple of ways that I mean they can reach
[43:50] SPEAKER_02: out to me but also can we connect with you post podcast what's the best way
[43:58] SPEAKER_02: we can do this again just phone email okay and what is your the best email to connect with you
[44:06] SPEAKER_03: uh for acres hydroponics at gmail.com
[44:18] SPEAKER_02: or show up at your farm 8 and 5 some products and have conversation
[44:23] SPEAKER_02: what's your just carry and where do you live guys what's your what's your
[44:28] SPEAKER_02: or acres sterling Ontario okay so this suggests that when when do you have products at your farm gate
[44:37] SPEAKER_02: your round hi you're the reason why we're doing this by the way thanks generation
[44:47] SPEAKER_02: love the kid bomb so and uh so they're in sterling and so do you have products at your farm gate
[44:54] SPEAKER_03: your round yeah yeah we just we don't have a store set up so if if you call a header email then we
[45:01] SPEAKER_03: can we can have an order ready for any income pick it up all right so that's this email and or
[45:07] SPEAKER_02: give you a call literally and place an order and go have a conversation and and you know you
[45:14] SPEAKER_02: guys can be this sort of stimulus for the next generation of superheroes coming together to have
[45:21] SPEAKER_02: uh boutique organic farms across Canada and certainly if because of the shipping container i
[45:28] SPEAKER_02: love it in postal areas where there were shipping containers are prolific you know and we have
[45:34] SPEAKER_02: a cross-candidate train line that we could throw off each yes so easy we needed to yeah yeah
[45:41] SPEAKER_02: perfect Brad christian i want to thank you for sharing your story and we'll direct people to
[45:48] SPEAKER_02: your story is also on your website and we wish you and your family all the best and i'm just
[45:55] SPEAKER_02: gonna take this little jort jussie morsel of your story and amplify it as much as possible and
[46:01] SPEAKER_02: and let's uh let's get that new economic model for food movement uh amplified
[46:08] SPEAKER_03: sounds good thank you thanks for your help
[46:11] SPEAKER_02: you went thank so is there anything else that we haven't yet talked about that you
[46:18] SPEAKER_02: that's an important part of this conversation so i don't think we broached the subject
[46:23] SPEAKER_01: about our food transparency that there is no transparency in our food production and that's one
[46:28] SPEAKER_01: of the biggest problems um when we tried to research and track back where our food was being produced
[46:36] SPEAKER_01: we were told by head office at law laws that they have non-disclosure agreements with their farmers
[46:42] SPEAKER_01: and they were unable to tell us exactly where that food was coming from wow why why do you have
[46:51] SPEAKER_01: a non-disclosure agreement who are you protecting are you protecting me are you protecting them
[46:56] SPEAKER_01: so i we were left in the dark to find out exactly where those grains were coming from
[47:05] SPEAKER_02: well that's interesting i expected that or um maybe i'll give law laws call in this
[47:14] SPEAKER_02: journey and see if if they can answer that question well you know why why is there an NDA in comparison
[47:23] SPEAKER_02: to you know in our in our co-working space we had a a fellow that was it was it was it was uh
[47:30] SPEAKER_02: firm to table we brainstormed this idea and there's these microchips that you can get that you
[47:36] SPEAKER_02: put on a product and let's just say it's your leaf of grains or your or your tote and it tracks
[47:41] SPEAKER_02: the whole journey from literally farm to table and at any point you know when it's just a QR code
[47:48] SPEAKER_02: that you can scan the whole thing and it sees what vehicle it was transported on you know so you
[47:54] SPEAKER_02: can see the whole life of the product and i think the chips um just to give you an idea or something
[47:59] SPEAKER_02: like six cents per unit to produce and suddenly it would that tiny little bit of technology
[48:08] SPEAKER_02: you know could pretty much eliminate the lack of transparency of where your food comes from
[48:15] SPEAKER_01: it it definitely could it would be priceless because it is so hard to track back where that it came
[48:23] SPEAKER_01: from to begin with because there's large farms coming together in these uh these warehouses
[48:29] SPEAKER_01: for packing and then it's being distributed from there so there's so many points at which you have
[48:35] SPEAKER_01: to stop and re-examine okay who's coming into this point and then it's like a spider web effect
[48:41] SPEAKER_01: so with us it's essentially a direct line right and it would be nice to see that with other farmers
[48:49] SPEAKER_01: their direct line and why shouldn't that be something we'd be proud of i'm proud of our direct line to us
[48:55] SPEAKER_02: absolutely other farmers what why are you eliminating the the
[49:02] SPEAKER_02: i mean not we can't get into a conversation about food waste i mean the the amount of
[49:08] SPEAKER_02: crazy amount of food waste in the system um that i've done a little bit of research on it
[49:13] SPEAKER_03: is it 40% is it 40 or 50% of food i've heard in North America right it's
[49:21] SPEAKER_02: it goes in the garbage and i think it's it's going back to abundance we we have the potential to have
[49:30] SPEAKER_02: food abundance yeah if our economic models or distribution models are are shifted and my gut instinct
[49:39] SPEAKER_02: is that the shift to hyper-mocal and being able to track right from from farm to table it's not just
[49:47] SPEAKER_02: something that we gave lip service to in you know it is a as a brand identity of for foodies and the
[49:54] SPEAKER_02: eighties it's actually now becoming a critical and essential you know shift that needs to be made with
[50:02] SPEAKER_02: supply chain disruption and and longevity and and personal health uh as a as a priority yeah
[50:11] SPEAKER_02: yeah there's been fabulous having you guys Kristen thanks for bringing up that last point once
[50:16] SPEAKER_02: again you can contact Brad and Kristen at four acres hydroponics um email i would also encourage you
[50:24] SPEAKER_02: to show up at their farm gate and get some or pre-orders organic uh protest if you're in the sterling
[50:31] SPEAKER_02: Ontario region and if you are in the food industry and or you are a boutique farmer and you are
[50:40] SPEAKER_02: as passionate about Brad and Kristen um to you know look at organic food production in your
[50:48] SPEAKER_02: local area we encourage you to reach out to us and contact us and once we have you know let's say
[50:55] SPEAKER_02: a hundred people that are interested and that that have said yes we will absolutely follow up with
[51:02] SPEAKER_02: some initiatives to bring people together and collaborate on what is really the next step to to
[51:09] SPEAKER_02: make some some scale will change happen Brad Kristen thanks again for being on the podcast
[51:15] SPEAKER_04: welcome thank you although um now are you actually officially organic
[51:26] SPEAKER_03: no we're not organic because we can't be certified organic because we're hydroponic there's uh in
[51:33] SPEAKER_03: Canada um you have to be growing in soil in order to pass whatever uh inspections they do to get
[51:42] SPEAKER_03: that certified organic label so since we're growing in water and we have no soil in the farm
[51:49] SPEAKER_02: they can't give us that certification it it sounds like a um perhaps a criteria that is
[51:58] SPEAKER_03: old school right well it's yeah i designed because uh because this threatens that industry or um
[52:08] SPEAKER_03: hydroponics has the ability to take over a good part or all of that and eliminate the need for
[52:15] SPEAKER_03: the massive soil farms that are so they have designed it so that that we can't get in it just to
[52:23] SPEAKER_02: slow the progress of this technology i think well and so maybe for the purposes of of our audience is
[52:32] SPEAKER_02: you know the official label of organic i am very aware um because of of some local farmers sharing with
[52:40] SPEAKER_02: me is very time-consuming resource intensive and and clearly technically there's some criteria like
[52:51] SPEAKER_02: growing in soil that makes it very difficult at times for somebody to actually that's another
[52:57] SPEAKER_02: potential barrier uh that if organic is really the the label that people are looking for um you know
[53:05] SPEAKER_02: at the consumer that gotta be other options and and um to grow the industry of organic farming
[53:14] SPEAKER_02: and and still be consumed desired by the by the consumer transparency yeah transparency more
[53:22] SPEAKER_01: awareness with what hydroponics is because there is a lack of knowledge a general
[53:28] SPEAKER_01: lack of knowledge of what hydroponic growing is and we have been turned down by retail places because
[53:35] SPEAKER_01: they only sell organic and we have no label however ours i would consider better than organic
[53:44] SPEAKER_01: we don't use anything where or the farmers have a list of uh certified products they can use and
[53:51] SPEAKER_01: still maintain that label also you talk about food waste or the shipping right food uh seed to
[53:59] SPEAKER_01: plate how long is that right that it is our our food is still alive when it hits your plate and
[54:07] SPEAKER_02: Kristen you said something that actually surprised me which is the shelf life is incredible
[54:14] SPEAKER_01: yes the shelf life of our products i just had some first out of last night it was harvested
[54:19] SPEAKER_01: March 16 so yesterday was March or April 5th and it was still crunchy you would not know
[54:27] SPEAKER_01: as it was harvested yesterday it amazes me i'm still going away at how long this product lasts
[54:35] SPEAKER_02: wow that's fantastic and so really we need to wave another magic one which is we need another
[54:41] SPEAKER_02: sort of you know knowledge center and maybe food labeling around hydroponic food and the the fact
[54:50] SPEAKER_02: that this is maybe the evolution of food on scale that's healthy and you know from firm to table
[54:59] SPEAKER_02: we we can grow that that movement of consumers