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TRANSCRIPTION WITH SPEAKERS
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[00:32] SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Canada's Podcast.
[00:37] SPEAKER_01: Hello, I'm Mario Toniguchi, Managing Editor of Canada's podcast.
[00:42] SPEAKER_01: Today on Calgary's podcast, we have Amanda Hamilton, who is creative director and founder
[00:49] SPEAKER_01: of Amanda Hamilton Interior Design and Palette Archives.
[00:54] SPEAKER_01: Thanks Amanda for joining us today.
[00:56] SPEAKER_02: Thank you for having me and I have to note, I'm also the founder of Three Foot Nothing Construction,
[01:01] SPEAKER_02: which I started just before the pandemic, too.
[01:04] SPEAKER_01: Great, I am glad you mentioned that.
[01:07] SPEAKER_02: So hard behind me right there?
[01:10] SPEAKER_02: Excellent.
[01:11] SPEAKER_01: Well, let's start by just explaining what those three entities are of what you do.
[01:18] SPEAKER_01: Let's start with the Interior Design component.
[01:22] SPEAKER_02: Yeah, for sure. So I found it.
[01:24] SPEAKER_02: My Interior Design company formerly incorporated in 2009, but started in 2007.
[01:30] SPEAKER_02: So it's been a while now and we do work both in, well actually across a couple different,
[01:35] SPEAKER_02: we do residential, we do commercial, we do hospitality, and we work with a lot of real estate
[01:39] SPEAKER_02: developers. So that's everything from putting together a full set of construction drawings,
[01:43] SPEAKER_02: to specifications, finishes and materials.
[01:45] SPEAKER_02: And then we all also do a ton of furniture procurement, art accessories styling.
[01:52] SPEAKER_02: We do that across Western Canada and projects as far East as Toronto,
[01:57] SPEAKER_02: when we have projects also into the US with some projects down south as well.
[02:02] SPEAKER_02: So that's lovely, it takes me all over the place from a traveling standpoint,
[02:07] SPEAKER_02: which is great.
[02:09] SPEAKER_01: Now what about Palette Archives? What's that?
[02:11] SPEAKER_02: Yeah, Palette Archives. So that was sort of, that was our solution to, like, you know,
[02:17] SPEAKER_02: we meet with these amazing people. And of course, Interior Design Services, you know, it is,
[02:22] SPEAKER_02: it is a more luxury service often. And so what we were finding is there was this whole
[02:27] SPEAKER_02: niche of the market that wasn't being served. So what Palette Archives is, it's a really democratized
[02:32] SPEAKER_02: design and it's an e-commerce site. And we've got over 35 pre-curated finishes and materials
[02:37] SPEAKER_02: palettes. So if you're somebody who's maybe, like, undergoing a renovation and you kind of want
[02:41] SPEAKER_02: to manage it on your own, maybe you're not in the position to hire an Interior Designer or perhaps
[02:45] SPEAKER_02: you don't want to hire an Interior Designer, you can order one of our boxes online, they're $125.
[02:52] SPEAKER_02: And then basically all of your finishes and materials shipped right to your door. So instead of
[02:56] SPEAKER_02: you running all over the city and trying to figure everything out, this kind of the decision for you.
[03:02] SPEAKER_02: And that's what a lot of clients say. They go, I know what I like, but I don't know how to bring it
[03:05] SPEAKER_02: all together. So we bring it all together. And then I guess the construction company we started,
[03:11] SPEAKER_02: you know, probably I think that was in 2019, right before the pandemic. And again, it was just
[03:18] SPEAKER_02: like trying to find this niche. We were having not really great experiences with some of our contractors.
[03:22] SPEAKER_02: And we wanted to be able to control the experience from start to finish. So all the way from the design,
[03:28] SPEAKER_02: you know, through to the construction and then the final sort of installation. We just,
[03:32] SPEAKER_02: we just thought we were in a position to be able to do it a bit better than it had been done.
[03:37] SPEAKER_02: And really wanted to focus on the transparency with the client so that they knew that we were really
[03:41] SPEAKER_02: taking care of them. They knew where their dollars are going. You hear all sorts of four stories
[03:45] SPEAKER_02: in the construction industry. And so yeah, that's been going really, really well. And has been a really
[03:50] SPEAKER_02: nice ad for our Interior Design clients who generally also have a little bit of construction
[03:55] SPEAKER_01: with their scope of work. Okay. So tell me how you got into all this like initially, like,
[04:04] SPEAKER_01: what was the motivation and the inspiration to get involved in this kind of industry?
[04:10] SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely. I feel like I was an accidental entrepreneur. I did not grow up in a family of
[04:16] SPEAKER_02: entrepreneurs. I didn't even, I didn't even think I knew what that was growing up. But I was a
[04:21] SPEAKER_02: creative artsy person, right? And so I used to do a lot of musical theater and acting and singing.
[04:30] SPEAKER_02: I played a few instruments. I was always, you know, somebody who wrote a lot, read a lot. I used to draw
[04:36] SPEAKER_02: a ton. And so I actually went to, once I graduated high school, I went to the University of Alberta
[04:42] SPEAKER_02: into the General Arts program. And I just, it just was too general for me. And I just remember sitting
[04:48] SPEAKER_02: down one day and kind of having like an a bit of an epiphany. I was like online checking out a few
[04:54] SPEAKER_02: different things. And I found Interior Design. I just sort of stumbled upon it. And originally,
[04:59] SPEAKER_02: I kind of wanted architecture. But I'm really glad I selected Interior Design because it just feels
[05:05] SPEAKER_02: like the perfect combination of all of my skill sets. And then I think there was that other side of
[05:10] SPEAKER_02: my personality, which was really well suited to being an entrepreneur, right? You know, I was always
[05:15] SPEAKER_02: the person like when I was a kid who'd like leading the group or coming up with the ideas and
[05:20] SPEAKER_02: getting people to like follow along. So it all happened like really organically, I would say. But
[05:25] SPEAKER_02: that's kind of what it was. It's like, yeah, it was just like a lot of arts mixed with like the right
[05:30] SPEAKER_02: and the left hand side of my brain. I've got to co-mingle. Now, you've won a several awards
[05:38] SPEAKER_01: over the years. You know, everything from, you know, designed to business awards, etc, etc.
[05:45] SPEAKER_01: Now, I don't know if you recall, but way back in time, way back in time,
[05:53] SPEAKER_01: when I was with the Calgary Herald, I remember doing a story on you when you just started
[05:58] SPEAKER_01: the business. And you know, I remember interviewing you in your home. And so my question to you is
[06:06] SPEAKER_01: like, how does someone, you were young at that time? Still are. You're still young.
[06:12] SPEAKER_01: 41 now. I think yeah, this is my late 20s. How did you get from those sort of humble and small
[06:25] SPEAKER_01: beginnings to where you are now? Very successful entrepreneur and business woman known throughout
[06:32] SPEAKER_02: Canada and US internationally. Yeah, I mean, I feel like I have lots of things to reflect on and
[06:42] SPEAKER_02: lots of people to think. I think I think some of it was inherent to my personality, right? I grew
[06:47] SPEAKER_02: up in a kind of an unusual family setting. I was raised by my grandparents alongside my mom and
[06:53] SPEAKER_02: her three younger siblings. And so we, you know, we always joke around about it being like
[06:57] SPEAKER_02: free-range parenting, right? My grandparents were both like, working full time. My mom was working
[07:02] SPEAKER_02: two jobs, you know, to sort of make ends meet. And so I was in this large family structure. There's
[07:11] SPEAKER_02: very young age. I became wildly independent, right? So I think independence and that grit and
[07:17] SPEAKER_02: that tenacity is something that sort of followed me into school. And then also because I've come from
[07:23] SPEAKER_02: a family of educators, I actually followed them around to different schools. So I actually went to
[07:27] SPEAKER_02: 13 different schools between kindergarten and my finishing of university. So that also meant,
[07:32] SPEAKER_02: you know, I had to be very adaptable. I had to be very resilient. I had to like be really comfortable
[07:38] SPEAKER_02: with change. And I think all of those things are necessary to be an entrepreneur, to really excel
[07:44] SPEAKER_02: in that area. And then of course, I think, you know, everyone has a little bit of their story of how
[07:51] SPEAKER_02: do they got the leg up. It was actually a client of mine who I was, I was moon lighting at the time.
[07:56] SPEAKER_02: And I shouldn't have been. And my boss has found out at my very first job and they're like, you're
[08:01] SPEAKER_02: not gonna make a choice. And like when I say moon lighting, I was designing like 5,000 square foot
[08:05] SPEAKER_02: restaurants, you know, one year out of school. And I was doing it the evenings while I had a full
[08:09] SPEAKER_02: time design job. And I was also working at a restaurant three times a week. So, you know, I think
[08:14] SPEAKER_02: there was a big work ethic portion there that was, I would say, I have to attribute to my grandmother.
[08:19] SPEAKER_02: She didn't retire until she was 82 years old. So I think that work ethic was a big one. But it was
[08:24] SPEAKER_02: also that client to push me saying like, you can do this on your own. So I ultimately did that.
[08:30] SPEAKER_02: And some of my first clients were actually my former husband's clients. And so he, he's a
[08:36] SPEAKER_02: personal trainer. And so he would work with a lot of really high net worth clients who also needed
[08:41] SPEAKER_02: interior design services. And so that's kind of how I got my foot in the door from a residential
[08:45] SPEAKER_02: standpoint. And then also a restaurant standpoint. So we really made a name for ourselves because I
[08:51] SPEAKER_02: started doing a ton of restaurants. And then all of a sudden everybody was like, who is this person?
[08:55] SPEAKER_02: And I guess the rest is history from there. You know, I think I have to attribute so much
[09:02] SPEAKER_02: of my success to an amazing team. We focus a ton on company culture. We put a lot of education
[09:08] SPEAKER_02: back into the studio. A lot of resources back into the studio making sure that our people are
[09:12] SPEAKER_02: happy. And that's, you know, if your people are happy, your clients are happy in my mind, right?
[09:18] SPEAKER_02: For the most part. So I think a lot of it has to do with the incredible people that I actually
[09:24] SPEAKER_02: have working at my studio for. I attribute a lot of my success to having just incredible people
[09:28] SPEAKER_01: around me. So in your bio, two words came out, jumped out at me that describe you. Bold and
[09:38] SPEAKER_01: unorthodox. Explain that to me. How do you think you're bold and unorthodox?
[09:45] SPEAKER_02: Ooh, this is a good question. You're like, let's see if there's a story here.
[09:50] SPEAKER_02: I think, you know, in many ways, those are words that have been attributed to me. You know,
[09:55] SPEAKER_02: I don't know that I necessarily was the person going around me like, I'm bold and unorthodox.
[09:59] SPEAKER_02: But I think in that sense, the way that I look at it is I'm really committed to the creative
[10:04] SPEAKER_02: industry and creative professionals, creative entrepreneurs. I believe that we deserve to earn a living.
[10:13] SPEAKER_02: I think that we deserve the respect that a lot of other professions get that we may not necessarily
[10:18] SPEAKER_02: really get. So when I think about being unorthodox is the fact that I do truly believe that you can
[10:23] SPEAKER_02: be an artist and a creative person and make a living for yourself. I think there is this notion
[10:28] SPEAKER_02: and I used to have it that I had to break through that like if you were going to be a creative person
[10:33] SPEAKER_02: that you're going to be, you're not going to make no money, you're going to be poor, right? And
[10:37] SPEAKER_02: then if you went to go make money that you were selling out. And I think that that's just old school
[10:41] SPEAKER_02: notion. We just need to get rid of it. And so in that way, I do, I feel like I speak out a ton
[10:46] SPEAKER_02: about women in business, about creative professions, making sure that we get paid. We're often the
[10:52] SPEAKER_02: first profession if there's some sort of event or something going on. It's like the photographer,
[10:57] SPEAKER_02: oh, see if the photographer will just come for a few hours and photograph. Not thinking about all
[11:02] SPEAKER_02: the time and effort associated with that. Or like somebody to come in due to core. And the amount
[11:06] SPEAKER_02: of times I have been asked Mario to come to somebody's house and then come up with a concept with them
[11:12] SPEAKER_02: unpaid. And they're just to see if they like it. And it's like, no, I have, I have a portfolio.
[11:17] SPEAKER_02: That's like saying to your tax accountant, well, I guess how much money you can save me. And then
[11:22] SPEAKER_02: if I like that number out, why is it that in creative professions, it's okay to just like not pay
[11:29] SPEAKER_01: the designer or the artist, you know, or being a writer and people knowing they're saying, hey,
[11:34] SPEAKER_01: you know, what we've done in a vent coming up. Couldn't you publicize it? Well, exactly. And I've
[11:40] SPEAKER_02: written a book too. So it's like, I've done all of these creative things. And so I think when I
[11:45] SPEAKER_02: think about being bold and unorthodox, yes, it's for sure about how we approach the design community.
[11:53] SPEAKER_02: But I actually think it's more, it's less about like the design and it's more about how do we
[11:57] SPEAKER_02: approach our team? How do we approach like our stance in Calgary? How do we better the community?
[12:02] SPEAKER_02: How do we create legacy? So to me, it's like, it's bigger than just creating bold and unorthodox
[12:08] SPEAKER_02: design. It's really how we take our creative business and how we actually act from a day-to-day
[12:13] SPEAKER_01: standpoint that I find different. So where does a creativity come for you on a daily basis and
[12:20] SPEAKER_01: inspiration? You know, does it just pop in your head? You're out walking in the woods one day
[12:27] SPEAKER_02: and boom, the idea comes. It's a really great question. And again, as a creative person, that is
[12:33] SPEAKER_02: one of the first questions you get asked. And it's sometimes a tough, tough question to answer.
[12:38] SPEAKER_02: I think, I think for the most part, people feel like, oh, you go online, it's Pinterest and travel,
[12:43] SPEAKER_02: travel's a really big one. But for me, what I've learned, and I kind of call it like white space,
[12:48] SPEAKER_02: this notion of white space, this like breathing space, right? The emptiness, I find an emptiness is
[12:54] SPEAKER_02: actually where your brain shuts down enough, where new ideas come for it. So they're in very unorthodox
[13:01] SPEAKER_02: situations. I generally find it's like on the treadmill or I'm in the shower, you know,
[13:06] SPEAKER_02: I'm out for a walk, I'm camping. It's actually generally when I'm doing nothing related to interior
[13:12] SPEAKER_02: design. We are inundated with so much new information in this industry. So it's actually when you
[13:18] SPEAKER_02: like step outside of it a bit that I find you are inspired by, you know, adjacent industries or
[13:25] SPEAKER_02: just other situations. And then of course, like I have to say, travel is a big one for me, but
[13:29] SPEAKER_02: I think it's travel combined with quiet, right? Like just just looking and walking and having no
[13:38] SPEAKER_02: agenda and just like picking up something very organically, not knowing when you're going to use
[13:43] SPEAKER_00: that little bit of inspiration. Running a new business can be stressful. The last thing you need
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[14:23] SPEAKER_01: insurance experts. Now a good friend of mine is an artist and very successful artist known
[14:29] SPEAKER_01: internationally. And I remember him telling me one day about how, you know, he really has two jobs
[14:35] SPEAKER_01: right and the one job that he has is being the artist. The other job that he has is being the
[14:41] SPEAKER_01: business person. I imagine that's the same for you. How do you juggle those two and still keep
[14:49] SPEAKER_01: the creative side of what Amanda Hamilton is still out there? It's probably the thing I've struggled
[14:57] SPEAKER_02: with the most and probably one of the hardest things. I feel like I deal with on a day to day basis.
[15:05] SPEAKER_02: How I do it is really committing to the fact that, you know, I've got a team of 13 people
[15:11] SPEAKER_02: and I feel very responsible for them. I feel responsible for their professional development. I
[15:19] SPEAKER_02: feel like they're doing personally even, you know, like we really do want our staff to be
[15:23] SPEAKER_02: incredibly seen and heard. And so you have to make room for that. And so there's this balance
[15:29] SPEAKER_02: of working on the business, which to me is a more entrepreneurial side and in the business for me,
[15:33] SPEAKER_02: which is a little bit more the creative side. And so how have I been able to strike that balance is
[15:38] SPEAKER_02: first contact with clients is generally with me so they can get a sense of what I'm all about,
[15:43] SPEAKER_02: what I'm nurturing at the studio, what A-hit is all about. And then I generally am involved
[15:49] SPEAKER_02: in the first design discovery meeting as well as the concept meeting for like some of the larger
[15:54] SPEAKER_02: projects. And that's to ensure that the creative direction, which is creative director is still
[15:59] SPEAKER_02: part of my role, founder and creative director. I'm still involved in making sure that I'm kind of
[16:04] SPEAKER_02: nurturing the direction of the project. That is why people are coming to our company, right? They
[16:08] SPEAKER_02: want to know that I'm involved. But the other part is then nurturing the designers behind the scenes.
[16:14] SPEAKER_02: And that's a harder transition for me to make because clients initially when we didn't set the
[16:20] SPEAKER_02: expectation up front were like, I expected you to be in every single meeting, but you just,
[16:24] SPEAKER_02: you can't. You can't be in every single meeting for every single client. So, you know, really I work
[16:28] SPEAKER_02: behind the scenes with the designers to make them the best versions of themselves to make sure that
[16:34] SPEAKER_02: they have the tools, to make sure that they would design in a way that I would design in too,
[16:39] SPEAKER_02: while still having all of their own creative freedom. Like we have a ton of autonomy in our studio,
[16:43] SPEAKER_02: and we always say it's a bit of a democracy in here. It's what makes it fun for them to work in
[16:49] SPEAKER_02: is that I provide an environment like that, but it's not without guidance, right? It's not without
[16:54] SPEAKER_02: having a sense of where I want to see these projects go and having a sense of what I think the
[16:59] SPEAKER_02: clients need. They are hiring you for your opinion. And it takes some time when you get into your
[17:05] SPEAKER_02: career to be able to say like, no, you hired me for an opinion and I think you're not making the
[17:10] SPEAKER_02: right decision here. They get issues that they want afterwards, but yeah, it is a real balance of
[17:15] SPEAKER_02: going, I have to put all this time aside to run the business, but then also make sure that
[17:19] SPEAKER_02: clients are still kind of getting that personalized experience. Yeah. If you had somebody come up to you,
[17:25] SPEAKER_01: a young person, say in their 20s, like you were, and wanting some advice about becoming an entrepreneur,
[17:33] SPEAKER_02: what would you tell them? Oh my goodness. So many things, but this is, so this is the thing, Mario,
[17:41] SPEAKER_02: it's like I, I wouldn't go back and change a single thing, but the things that I would say to people,
[17:46] SPEAKER_02: like when I started my company, it was in the middle of the recession, I left a cushy job. I didn't,
[17:51] SPEAKER_02: it wasn't like I was let go and didn't have any other opportunity. I had savings, I had no business
[17:55] SPEAKER_02: experience. I would probably go back to most people and say, get your feet wet and make your mistakes
[18:03] SPEAKER_02: on somebody else's dime. So I learned a lot of early lessons because I was only graduated for
[18:09] SPEAKER_02: three years and then I started my company. Now, during those three years, though, I was very busy
[18:13] SPEAKER_02: at the firm I was working at and I was working freelance doing projects. So I do think that I probably
[18:18] SPEAKER_02: had twice the amount of years of experience because of that, but I would say just making sure you
[18:24] SPEAKER_02: feel really comfortable because I think you do your client a disservice if you come out and you
[18:29] SPEAKER_02: start on your own and you really don't have your feet wet. There's a lot of things you don't
[18:33] SPEAKER_02: work well that you just like you need to learn and be mentored under someone. So find a really great
[18:38] SPEAKER_02: mentor, work with them and if you're working with a really great company, they will teach you how
[18:46] SPEAKER_02: to start your own business. I have people who work for me that I know that they may eventually leave,
[18:51] SPEAKER_02: you know, a head and start their own company. My job, I believe as a mentor, is to set them up for
[18:57] SPEAKER_02: success. It doesn't mean that I'm going to put them out and make them my competitor, of course,
[19:01] SPEAKER_02: but like if you have goals to be this way, I'm going to give you the tools to go there.
[19:06] SPEAKER_02: You want to be able to support those people to move on. So that's what I would say. It's fine to
[19:10] SPEAKER_02: come to me where you're going to get a really great, great mentorship from somebody there who knows
[19:14] SPEAKER_02: that maybe potentially you're going to move on because you want to do this on your own.
[19:18] SPEAKER_01: So when you look back, I'm sure you've got hundreds of different projects. Is there one that has stood
[19:30] SPEAKER_01: out for you from the interior design perspective that you just thought that was really neat, that was
[19:36] SPEAKER_02: really cool. Well, one of my personal core values is legacy and I am obsessed with Calvary. I
[19:48] SPEAKER_02: am originally born and raised in Evanton, but I've been in Calvary now just as long as I was in
[19:53] SPEAKER_02: Evanton. And so one of the ones that kind of popped into my head first was Rodney's oyster house.
[19:59] SPEAKER_02: So the reason why I find that interesting is because I had an opportunity to work in a historical
[20:04] SPEAKER_02: building, I got to see that building change to many different things while I was in my 20s
[20:10] SPEAKER_02: and into my 30s. And then I had the opportunity to go back and return that building to look closer,
[20:16] SPEAKER_02: like what it used to be to really pull out the inherent sort of characters of that building.
[20:24] SPEAKER_02: And when I think about the work that we create, I do think about legacy. I think about how are we
[20:29] SPEAKER_02: helping shape the infrastructure of Calvary and how are we helping shape the experience of people
[20:35] SPEAKER_02: visiting from outside of Calvary? Right? Because like, now a bunch of real, we're not Toronto, we're not
[20:40] SPEAKER_02: Vancouver. People are predominantly coming here because they have family here, they're going to
[20:44] SPEAKER_02: be in the towns for, they're coming through the colors to compete. So like, I'm like, what's the
[20:49] SPEAKER_02: cool opportunity to be able to bring people here for other reasons? I think we have an amazing
[20:53] SPEAKER_02: food and beverage scene. I think there's a lot of beautiful things happening in arts and culture.
[20:58] SPEAKER_02: I just got back from the Glenvo tour. I had an arts common tour last week. It's cool to see
[21:03] SPEAKER_02: how we might in our lifetime touch Calvary and ideally improve it. So I think that one just
[21:11] SPEAKER_02: because it feels like a little bit of like a way that I was able to touch Calvary.
[21:15] SPEAKER_01: When you look at your industry, Amanda, what are some of the key trends you're seeing right now
[21:21] SPEAKER_02: in interior design? Yeah, so when I think about trends, trends are very cyclical. If you're talking
[21:30] SPEAKER_02: about very specific trends, but when I think about trends in terms of my industry from a business
[21:35] SPEAKER_02: standpoint, I think that there is this move towards being able to really find niches that haven't
[21:45] SPEAKER_02: been filled and service your client from multiple different aspects. So I think part of our success
[21:50] SPEAKER_02: has been because I have vertically stacked my businesses, right? It's not like I have four different
[21:54] SPEAKER_02: businesses in four different areas. You know, these businesses are all related to each other.
[21:59] SPEAKER_02: So I have the ability to service all different types of clients. And I also think that there has
[22:04] SPEAKER_02: traditionally been a big trend in, you know, the business advice is always like specializing
[22:09] SPEAKER_02: something and then do that thing over and over again, because that's how you get the efficiency.
[22:13] SPEAKER_02: Well, what's been really fantastic for us? I've been through three full cycles of recessions now.
[22:19] SPEAKER_02: One part of our business dips, another part goes up. So as an example, we're inhibited, we're
[22:23] SPEAKER_02: going into or I don't know, Albert, it feels like a bit of a bubble sometimes, but you know,
[22:28] SPEAKER_02: going into a bit of a recession recession, we find that renovations amp up. If I only did one
[22:35] SPEAKER_02: type of design when the pandemic hit, we would have been, we could have been decimated. Like, if I'd
[22:40] SPEAKER_02: only done restaurants, but because we do work across all different facets, yes, it makes things
[22:45] SPEAKER_02: slightly less efficient. Yes, it cuts into my margin. But what it does to me is make a slightly more
[22:52] SPEAKER_02: recession proof business so that when the market ends and flows. And so I think that there's more
[22:56] SPEAKER_02: companies now that are looking at different business lines and different avenues for revenue,
[23:02] SPEAKER_02: understanding, right? That this is how you also protect yourself and it's also how you
[23:07] SPEAKER_02: create some growth in your industry. So I mean, I feel like that is a bit of a trend that may not
[23:12] SPEAKER_01: have answered your question specifically, but no problem. So you mentioned your book. I'm
[23:19] SPEAKER_01: curious about that. Now, I'm going to get the title straight, not that likable and other stories I
[23:24] SPEAKER_01: told myself. Okay. Tell me what the book was about and why you wrote it. It has nothing to do
[23:30] SPEAKER_02: with an interior design and business, but I do plan on writing a more business related book afterwards.
[23:36] SPEAKER_02: But it's a it's a theoretical memoir and it's my coming of age story. So it's sort of chronicles
[23:41] SPEAKER_02: like, you know, from birth to grade 12. And it's just a collection of like funny essays. And
[23:48] SPEAKER_02: people always ask me like, well, why did you write a book? And I honestly, the only answer I have is
[23:52] SPEAKER_02: that it has story inside of me. And I actually think everyone has a story inside of them. And how
[23:56] SPEAKER_02: am these would it be if you could have access to everyone's memoir that you could understand why
[24:03] SPEAKER_02: they are the way they are? I think that would all be way more empathetic, way more patient,
[24:09] SPEAKER_02: way more understanding and like way more connected to people. So yeah, it was just like I was bullied
[24:15] SPEAKER_02: heavily from like grade six to grade 12. So there's stories about that. I joke around. It's kind of
[24:20] SPEAKER_02: about boobs, boys and maxi pads, you know, like it is definitely targeted a little bit more towards
[24:26] SPEAKER_02: a female audience, though I've had lots of my my my guy friends reach out to me and like, ah, write your
[24:32] SPEAKER_02: book. You know, so I think it's I think it's really about like finding yourself and finding your
[24:39] SPEAKER_02: place. And it's been so interesting also just watching the book grow online because it's available on
[24:44] SPEAKER_02: Amazon. And it continues to be a best seller in the FB, TQ category. And and specifically in the
[24:54] SPEAKER_02: coming out and everybody's like, is this a coming out story? It's actually not a coming out story.
[24:59] SPEAKER_02: But there's something there for people that is about not feeling seen, not feeling accepted,
[25:06] SPEAKER_02: not finding the people and the place around you where you can be yourself. So it's been really
[25:11] SPEAKER_02: interesting because I would never have expected that it would be living in that category at all. And
[25:17] SPEAKER_02: it's been a really beautiful gift to see people like really enjoying it in in that category.
[25:23] SPEAKER_01: Well, this must be pretty wild for you thinking right now like a ghetto and I'm thinking, okay,
[25:28] SPEAKER_01: where your past was and you thought, you know, talking about growing up and I'm being bullied and
[25:34] SPEAKER_01: all that not being accepted to now where you're well known, you're, you know, you're your high
[25:44] SPEAKER_01: profile, you know, everybody likes Amanda Hamilton type thing. What goes through your head when
[25:51] SPEAKER_02: you think about that? Well, I'm like, first of all, Murray, there's no way everyone likes me.
[25:56] SPEAKER_02: I think this is the book that I mean, the reason why the book is called Not That Likeable and
[26:01] SPEAKER_02: Other Stories I told myself has been very much about going through this story of like not feeling
[26:07] SPEAKER_02: likable, but also this notion that when you grow up, if you will, that all that stuff that
[26:14] SPEAKER_02: happened in your childhood goes away, but the reality is it really doesn't. So I mean, I think what
[26:20] SPEAKER_02: changes the older you get is you just care less. You just care less what other people think about you,
[26:26] SPEAKER_02: but I also think that there's been a bit of a shift. We were talking about this in my office
[26:30] SPEAKER_02: either tab, an office of women. And you know, when you see, when you see women treating other
[26:37] SPEAKER_02: women poorly, it used to just be a thing that people would participate in. You would just gossip,
[26:43] SPEAKER_02: and that would be the thing. And now it's just considered in my mind to be just like so unhealthy
[26:48] SPEAKER_02: and like tacky and just not like, you know, the notion that like women need to support women,
[26:55] SPEAKER_02: we already have had it hard enough in so many different different different areas that it's like
[27:01] SPEAKER_02: I think that there has been a bit of a shift of people just trying to capture that like,
[27:06] SPEAKER_02: it's okay that this is not somebody I would hang out with, but I can respect what they're doing.
[27:12] SPEAKER_02: So it's like, it's kind of a combination of that and then also just not caring anymore. I don't
[27:16] SPEAKER_02: think that everybody likes me, but also none of the expectation now that everybody likes me.
[27:21] SPEAKER_02: And then the flip side of that is also recognizing that there was a time when I thought no one
[27:26] SPEAKER_02: liked me and then I went through life and had so many people come back and say, you didn't realize
[27:31] SPEAKER_02: the impact you had on my life when you did this thing or you said that thing. We don't know,
[27:37] SPEAKER_02: that's the thing. That's the lesson. We don't know how much like something as silly as an
[27:43] SPEAKER_02: Instagram post that somebody just needed to hear that day. You know, the amount that happened. So
[27:49] SPEAKER_02: I feel like when you are, let's say a public figure or somebody who's influential or somebody
[27:55] SPEAKER_02: who's really involved in the community, you have a responsibility to act in a way that allows
[28:01] SPEAKER_02: other people to be able to sort of like come to you and act as hopefully somebody that's
[28:07] SPEAKER_02: inspirational and that they look up to. Yeah, to me, there's a social responsibility there.
[28:13] SPEAKER_01: All right. Wonderful. Well, thanks. Thank you for joining us today. Of course.
[28:20] SPEAKER_01: Right. That was nice. Oh, thank you. So my guest on Calgary's podcast has been a man
[28:27] SPEAKER_01: to Hamilton of Calgary. I'm Mario Toniguzzi, managing editor of Canada's podcast.
[28:32] SPEAKER_01: Thanks for joining us today.
